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Talk:American Mayhem
Unfinished? We have three pages on Darin McGowan's pitches for animated Muppet shows -- this page, Waiting for Kermit and Muppets 75. According to McGowan's website, these were unsolicited pitches that were never considered for production. There was one meeting, and McGowan was rejected a week later. These are very minor curiosities, and only relevant at all because McGowan posted information about them on his website. They don't belong in the same category as Johnny Carson and the Muppet Machine, or even Uncle Deadly's House of Badness, which was at least pitched by Kirk Thatcher. I'd propose deleting these three pages; I don't think they belong on the wiki. Does anybody agree / object? -- Danny (talk) 19:49, 6 June 2009 (UTC) :Yeah, this has come up before, and I agree that they don't fit. But it does seem worth including something in case someone's looking. Is there a suitable place where we can just link to McGowan's page and leave it at that? Otherwise, yeah, just delete. Kermit, Prince of Denmark is actually much the same, an unsolicited treatment, except it won an award, we have a ton more info and after that apparently Chris Curtin approached Lopez and Marx formally. So at least it makes for a more interesting page. -- Andrew Leal (talk) 19:56, 6 June 2009 (UTC) ::For what it's worth, Darin McGowan came to the wiki to talk about it here. —Scott (talk) 19:59, 6 June 2009 (UTC) :::I would say either delete them or merge them all into one article. I don't see the point in having three individual pages for them. But I also wouldn't object to loosing them. -- Brad D. (talk) 20:51, 6 June 2009 (UTC) ::::I think this could be worked into our new guidelines for fandom. This guy got his agent a meeting to pitch his ideas to Henson. —Scott (talk) 16:00, 11 June 2009 (UTC) :::::I think if a fan came up with an idea for a project and never made it, we wouldn't include them on the wiki. -- Danny (talk) 17:00, 11 June 2009 (UTC) ::::::McGowan achieved more in his fandom than MuppetDanny's Best Muppets Website Ever or Backstage with the Muppets. I'm just saying if we're keeping those, it's silly not to keep a page about someone who was professionally in talks with Henson about new show ideas. —Scott (talk) 17:31, 11 June 2009 (UTC) :::::::So you'd move this to the Muppet Fandom category? -- Danny (talk) 18:10, 11 June 2009 (UTC) ::::::::It's in a funny place in between fandom and unfinished. I'm not saying we need a major feature for it, but a mention on the wiki somewhere is merited. Brad started a sandbox page for notability of fan projects, but I don't think we've talked about the details yet. It would be fun to include Muppet Rawk and the Sesame Kaiju toys somehow in that description. —Scott (talk) 18:46, 11 June 2009 (UTC) :::::::::Yeah, I'm glad we're thinking about the notability for fan projects. I'm just not sure about applying that standard to this set of pages... I think the Muppet Fandom and Pilots & Pitches / Unfinished Projects categories are different, and have different guidelines. -- Danny (talk) 20:04, 11 June 2009 (UTC) ::::::::::I think it could be worked into fandom. I wouldn't really call these "Unfinished Projects" because Henson never really started anything here (not the idea, not purchasing an idea, not development, not pre-production, not anything...they basically just listened to an outsider's ideas and said "no thanks"). These were unsolicited pitches for Muppet television series. These are really just a step-up from your average fan-fiction; as the concepts were conceived by a "professional" and they were also organized and formally presented to (and somewhat considered by) The Jim Henson Company. I think Darin McGowan's pitches could essentially be considered a noteworthy form of fan-fic as his ideas and concepts were officially considered by Henson (whereas your average fan's idea for a TV show posted in the fan-fic section of the Muppet Central forums is really not that notable). I think these three pitches could pass as notable (they have unique and original fan-created content which gained an official audience with the Henson executives). It shows the potential of fans and their ideas. -- Brad D. (talk) 04:39, 12 June 2009 (UTC) Yeah, I could go with it as Muppet Fandom, although I still think we should combine them into one page. What would we call the combined page? -- Danny (talk) 16:18, 12 June 2009 (UTC) :Darin McGowan pitches? —Scott (talk) 16:25, 12 June 2009 (UTC)